Author	Topic:   is there a good and evil?
Dividian	posted 12/17/05 5:51 PM       IS THERE REALLY A GOOD AND EVIL thats absolute?
nameless	posted 12/18/05 1:15 AM     Of course not, how can there be? People recognize 'good' as that which makes them (individually and subjectively) feel 'better', more 'comfortable'. 'Evil' does the opposite. Shallow judgements. The Judeo/Xtian bible says that judging things as 'good' or 'bad' is a 'sin'. I say the we never!!! have enough data to riteously 'judge' anything or any one. It is a horribly egoic thing to do. Morality is defined as the attribution of 'good' and 'evil' to others and things. That is why I am a-moral. I do not judge. The only place that the 'concepts' of good and evil exist is in your mind. Thats it and thats all.
Dividian	posted 12/18/05 3:10 AM       agreed!!
jojo	posted 12/24/05 6:09 AM       What is good and evil anyway?
nameless	posted 12/25/05 10:27 PM     Generally speaking, 'good' is what makes you more 'comfortable' and 'evil' is what makes you less 'comfortable'. That seems to be most people's idea anyway! Hahahahah... a very 'personal' concept. What are they? Concepts is what they be. Concepts in Mind. Like everything else.
jojo	posted 12/31/05 1:12 AM       Evil can be seen as lack of goodness. It is a characteristic of something which is not as good as it should be. In other words, evil is almost synonymous with the word unsatisfactory. If something is satisfactory, then it is good. If it is more than satisfactory, then it is very good.
nameless	posted 1/1/06 2:00 AM     Hmmm, didn't I just say that? *__-
jojo	posted 1/6/06 12:22 AM       Yeah. But another problem is how do we know that something is good enough and not good enough. Did you think that comfort level is the criteria of good and evil?
nameless	posted 1/6/06 9:28 PM     From what I've seen and heard, yes, comfort level seems to be the subjective deciding factor in the common concepts of 'good and evil'.What do you mean by 'enough'? In Amerikkka, there is no such thing as.. 'enough'!
jojo	posted 1/22/06 3:04 AM       Enough means satisfactory. We need criteria and standards on what is satisfactory. perhaps objective criteria and standards.
nameless	posted 1/23/06 10:11 AM     Hahahahahhaahahaha!!!!! Not you too? Sheesh! *__- Objective?! Hahahahahaha... !
Dividian	posted 1/23/06 3:30 PM       Nameless, you cannot verify that everything is subjective... So why is it ridiculous he would suggest that? I would in fact believe it more logical that we can to a certian extent know of things objectiviley.. certainly experience doesn't contradict that claim, and i believe thats sufficient enough...
wang	posted 1/24/06 1:14 PM       good and evil is related to good and bad or right and wrong these are the conflicts in our daily life,see everyday we experience different kind of situation and in a situation we always think what we should do or to act on it sometimes we choose good action and bad action on it...therefore good and evil is always present in our daily life...cheers !
Dividian	posted 1/24/06 3:39 PM       Though i don't believe we relate to everything subjectively, or rather i'm doubtful of it, i do believe that good and evil are concepts that are deffinitily subjective... thats overtly obvious, so what you're saying is kinda of ridiculous.. Its impossible to have any objective criteria to go off of to determine what should be satisfactory and what should be deprecated because its all really relative to the consitiution of an indiviudal and so will differ from indiviudal to indiviudal. There are no definite standards to be had. I could recieve pleasure from molesting and torturing little children as Charles de rie (or something like that) did in the 1600's, and that would be good to me because it suits my constituion and what is pleasurable to it.. -----------------------------Nameless, Is that bad? does that mean he's sleep walking and that someone who recieves pleasure from being kind and generous to others isn't? Namless you're belief in that is utterly absurd....You're nature is what determines how you are really, what you recieve pleasure from doing, and the natural propensities that you have. Its all human experience too, why should one aspect of it be more praised than another?.. The fact is we need violence, we need to see destruction and choas.. We revel in that orgiastic state such things invoke in us. And if anyone disagrees with that then why dont you turn on the t.v. and look at the moral concepts you find.. THere are the good guys and the bad guys, and there's violence or disputes that happens between the two.. both are equally needed to captivate the veiwer.. I would venture to say the same thing in real life. People need crime, they need to know there's danger for it exilerates them, without it we would be dull minded... Just as we need wars, its quite simply a natural instinct of humans to wish for such things.. SO why dont we all be beyond willing and embrace all of human experience? Though of course since we have so idiotically focused entirley on progressing in science and technology we now have nuclear weapons that could cause the exstinction of the human race..
nameless	posted 1/24/06 7:42 PM     Nameless, Is that bad?~~~~~~ I DON'T 'DO' GOOD AND BAD.~~~~~~ does that mean he's sleep walking and that someone who recieves pleasure from being kind and generous to others isn't? ~~~~~~~~~ NO, EVERYONE IS 'SLEEPWALKING'. EVERYONE THAT IS NOT 'AWAKE' TO THE FACT THAT THEY ARE DREAMING IS 'SLEEPING' AND SLEEPWALKING THROUGH THEIR LIVES. AND PEOPLE BELIEVE IN ANGELS, GODS, DEVILS, THE TOOTH FAIRY AND SANTA, WHY SHOULDN'T YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU CAN OBJECTIVELY EXPERIENCE SOMETHING OR THAT YOU CAN PERCEIVE SOME KIND OF OBJECTIVE REALITY? I LOVE THE WAY THAT YOU PUT WORDS IN MY MOUTH AND CALL ME RIDICULOUS. YOU DON'T HAVE TO GO THAT FAR, JUST ASK.. I'LL BE THE FIRST TO ADMIT THAT AT TIMES I CAN BE RIDICULOUS.. BUT NOT THAT YOU HAVE EVER SEEN. WHEN AND IF YOU LOSE THE NEED TO BELIEVE, YOUR VISION WILL CLEAR SOME. PEACE...
Dividian	posted 1/24/06 8:21 PM     NO, EVERYONE IS 'SLEEPWALKING'. EVERYONE THAT IS NOT 'AWAKE' TO THE FACT THAT THEY ARE DREAMING IS 'SLEEPING' AND SLEEPWALKING THROUGH THEIR LIVES. AND PEOPLE BELIEVE IN ANGELS, GODS, DEVILS, THE TOOTH FAIRY AND SANTA, WHY SHOULDN'T YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU CAN OBJECTIVELY EXPERIENCE SOMETHING OR THAT YOU CAN PERCEIVE SOME KIND OF OBJECTIVE REALITY? I LOVE THE WAY THAT YOU PUT WORDS IN MY MOUTH AND CALL ME RIDICULOUS. ---no Nameless, I never called you ridiculous, i said the belief that some people are sleep walking because they violate the rights of others is ridiculous... yes you said that everyone is sleep walking who believe that they are not dreaming, but in the thread 'is morality obligatory or not', you specifically said people who don't adhere to laws and that violate the rights of others, or something to that extent, are sleeping walking.. And thats what i thought as ridiculous... sorry if that sounds rude, i had not intentions of making it that way.
nameless	posted 1/24/06 8:59 PM       ....or something to that extent, are sleeping walking.. And thats what i thought as ridiculous... sorry if that sounds rude, i had not intentions of making it that way. ~~~~~~~~ ONCE AGAIN YOU CARELESSLY MISREAD WHAT I HAVE WRITTEN AND CALL IT RIDICULOUS. THAT "....or something to that extent" PROVES MY POINT. ~~~~~~ i said the belief that some people are sleep walking because they violate the rights of others is ridiculous... ~~~~ I AGREE. I HAVE NEVER SAID ANYTHING LIKE THAT, THOUGH. PERHAPS IF YOU READ MORE CAREFULLY? I WASN'T TALKING ABOUT RIGHTS OR VIOLATIONS... I AM NOT GOING TO MAKE ANY MORE ATTEMPTS TO CLARIFY WHAT YOU CAN'T BE BOTHERED TO READ CAREFULLY AS YOU DON'T READ THE CLARIFICATIONS ANY MORE CAREFULLY THAN THE ORIGINAL. IT GETS TOO TIRING.
Dividian	posted 1/24/06 9:20 PM     You said people need rules because they are sleep-walkers... i just read over you're post..
Dividian	posted 1/24/06 10:03 PM       in the very beggining of the thread..
nameless	posted 1/25/06 6:39 AM       I said that everyone is sleepwalking; criminals and saints. What's the problem?
Dividian	posted 1/25/06 10:52 AM     Yes but at the beggining you put particular emphasis on there needing to be laws because people are sleeping walking, meaning that anyone who goes against the law just has to be sleep walking...I could be aware of hte fact that i'm dreaming and commit a crime now couldnt I? and i wouldn't be sleep walking, for i would be aware that i'm asleep.
nameless	posted 1/26/06 4:06 AM     Yes but at the beggining you put particular emphasis on there needing to be laws because people are sleeping walking, ~~~~~~ I SAID THAT THERE HAS TO BE LAWS BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE TOO STUPID TO RUN THEIR OWN LIVES. THEY ARE STILL 'SLEEPWALKING'. THE 'AWAKENED/ENLIGHTENED' ARE VERY NOT CRIMINALS.~~~~ meaning that anyone who goes against the law just has to be sleep walking...~~~~~~ ANYONE FOLLOWING THE LAW IS SLEEPWALKING TOO. YOU ARE CREATING AN ARTIFICIAL DICHOTOMY. IF EVERYONE IS 'ASLEEP' AT ALL TIMES, EVERYTHING IS 'DONE' BY 'SLEEPERS'. WHERE'S THE PROBLEM? ~~~~~~~~~ I could be aware of hte fact that i'm dreaming and commit a crime now couldnt I? THAT IS POSSIBLE, BUT EXCEEDING RARE THAT AN AWAKENED PERSON WOULD DO SOMETHING DETRIMENTAL TO A FELLOW CREATURE. BY CRIME, I AM LIMITING THE TERM TO 'CREATING A VICTIM', NOT SMOKING A JOINT IN AMERIKKKA! ~~~~~ and i wouldn't be sleep walking, for i would be aware that i'm asleep. ~~~~~ TELL YOU WHAT. GO AHEAD AND DO THE EXPERIMENT. INSTEAD OF HYPOTHETICAL SPECULATION, GO AHEAD AND AWAKEN! THEN THE 'ANSWER' TO YOUR HYPOTHETICAL QUESTION WILL BE READILY AND DISTINCTLY ANSWERED.
jojo	posted 1/28/06 2:45 AM       Yes, Dividian. There are absolute truths about good and evil that are universal, objective and unchanging. 1. UNIVERSAL - It is true to all people, culture and situations.2. OBJECTIVE - It depends on external truths, not on internal preferences, feelings and opinion.3. UNCHANGING - It is true at all times, past, present and future.
headsmith	posted 8/30/06 4:57 PM       There is a positive good. The absolute good is beatitude after death. There is no positive evil. Evil is simply something less than good. The relative good is simply realizing an expectation. A relative evil is something less than that. In religious terms, Satan (Hebrew = "the Evil One") is good in the sense that he exists. All that exists is good. But within that, Satan has decided that he not only wants to control everything in between his origin and end, but he also wants to control his end, and, more to the point, he knows he can't. And so, since he can't change his mind now -- he is a fallen angel and since angels are pure spirits, they can't change their minds -- his only choice left is to try to damage his Creator as much as possible before he passes back into the nothingness from which the Creator called him at his origin. But if he could change his mind, his remaining goodness -- existence itself -- would permit him to re-decide. He could leave his end up to his Creator and achieve absolute goodness. This is the pattern for all of us, who are not pure spirits and so can change our minds about what to do next at any time.
John	posted 3/28/07 8:45 PM     There are many theories written and explained by leaders of religions, philosophers, theologians, intellectuals, academics, and scholars on the subject of truth attempting to resolve a problem for possibly identifying a truthful proposition that is universally valid for all humans for all time. To date they still are unable to solve this. As to why they can't is beyond me. I can only consider their failure to solve it as being total stupidity on their part. They can use the word truth and this word alone jumps out screaming giving them the answer.Truth is the essential core encompassing morality. Morality is essential for all humans to understand the difference between right and wrong. Truth and morality combine to give humans the essential core basisof conscience. Conscience acts as a moral compass in the inner most thoughts, emotions, feelings, and emotions of humans. A moral compass of conscience is the only basis that humans have to use in order to make decisions to do what is morally right, not what is morally wrong. As far as I know truth has never been identified or discussed by anyone for being a simple one word philosophy. This simple one word philosophy is"truth is the only thing in life that can ever make life right and the living of it ever being right". This philosophy applies equally to all humans and affects every aspect of life. Hence, as such it is the only thing in life that can ever be universally valid for all humans for all time. Tuth is good and lying is evil. It's as old as dirt. One only has to look at the history of wars, atrocities, and heinous committed from ancient times to contemporary times, to those being commited today.In some cases a few were destroyed by cataclysmic acts of nature but in most cases they were destroyed by acts of war and atrocities committed against humanity. In some cases a few were destroyed after a several hundred years and in other cases a thousand or several thousand years. Regardless of the reason for their destruction the one irrefutable fact that stands out in the history of life is the irrefutable fact that all did. Furthermore, based on what is going on today it shows all eventually will unless their is some real truths understood and recognized by everyone in the world. To philosophize about anything in life is ok. However, to do so without understanding the simple importance of truth is a waste of time.
ez	posted 8/26/07 1:12 AM       i must dissagree with nameless. you are correct in the way that good and evil is based on personal benifit, but the scale of good and evil exists nonetheless. the reason i called it a scale is because thats the only nature that it exists in. it is not a force if thats what your saying. good and evil is much like a ruler. a ruler is a scale, but not a force. Good in evil exists because its merely a scale by which one measures the intention behind a deed.

Back To My Home Page  | Post New Topic